HOST: As we mark 20 years of StoryCorps… we’re sharing classic conversations…with updates…
In this story, we catch up with one extraordinary mother…
Mary Johnson (MJ): My name is Mary Johnson and we’re in Minneapolis, Minnesota.
HOST: That was 2011, when Mary sat down with Oshea [oh-SHAY] Israel…
As a teenager, Oshea got into a fight with Mary’s son and killed him.
After he served a prison sentence for murder… they had this conversation…
MJ: You and I met at Stillwater Prison. I wanted to know if you were in the same mindset of what I remembered from court, where I wanted to go over and hurt you. But you were not that 16-year-old. You were a grown man. I shared with you about my son.
Oshea Israel (OI): And he became human to me. You know, when I met you it was like, ok, this guy, he’s real. And then, when it was time to go, you broke down and started shedding tears. The initial thing to do was just try and hold you up as best I can–just hug you like I would my own mother.
MJ: And I began to say: ”I just hugged the man that murdered my son.” And I instantly knew that all that anger and the animosity, all the stuff I had in my heart for 12 years for you–I knew it was over, that I had totally forgiven you.
OI: As far as receiving forgiveness from you–sometimes I still don’t know how to take it because I haven’t totally forgiven myself yet. It’s still a process that I’m going through.
MJ: I treat you as I would treat my son. And our relationship is beyond belief. We live next door to one another.
OI: Yeah. We actually bump into each other all the time leaving in and out of the house. And, you know, our conversations, they come from ”Boy, how come you ain’t called over here to check on me in a couple of days? You ain’t even asked me if I need my garbage to go out!”
MJ: Uh-huh.
OI: I find those things funny because it’s a relationship with a mother for real.
MJ: Well, my natural son is no longer here. I didn’t see him graduate. Now you’re going to college. I’ll have the opportunity to see you graduate. I didn’t see him getting married. Hopefully one day, I’ll be able to experience that with you.
OI: You still believe in me. And the fact that you can do that despite how much pain I’ve caused you, it’s amazing. I love you, lady.
MJ: I love you too, son.
[MUSIC] :08
OI: Well, Mary, it’s been 12 years since we sat down for our first StoryCorps interview and a lot has changed. I, myself, have two children: my son, he’s three. And a little girl…
Mary Johnson-Roy (MJR): She’s how old now?
OI: She’s six years old now. I remember when she was born you helped me get the car seat for her.
But since we were living next door to each other, you left me for another fella. His name is Ed [Laughs]. I remember when I first got wind of the you and Ed going out on dates. I’m like, wait, what’s going on? You was mine. But you all blessed me with the opportunity to not only be present in the wedding but to walk you down the aisle, that was, like, again, your words: beyond belief.
MJR: Yeah.
OI: It’s just been an amazing journey. From a hug, to you being a grandmother through me with my kids, to you just being a beacon of light to a lot of people.
On our last interview we ended it with me saying I love you, lady. And I still feel the same way.
[MUSIC]
HOST: Mary has spent decades helping other families who have lost children to gun violence…
But in 2021, she was diagnosed with Lewy Body Dementia…And had to step back a bit from her life’s work.
Her husband, Ed Roy, has been her main caretaker…
Ed also had a son who was murdered, in fact, that’s how he and Mary met.
They sat down together… to talk about Mary’s illness…
Ed Roy (ER): There was a lot of things that neither one of us didn’t understand — leaving something on the stove, parking your car a few houses down the street. And as it progressed, you started seeing things — the invisible people. And we talked about it, honey. You know, what do we do? We made humor out of them. We call them the little people [Laughs].
MJR: [Laughs]
ER: So just like when you had, like, several bowls of cereal out, you was feeding them. And I said, look now. You giving all my Cap’n Crunch to the little people. What about me? [Laughs] And you started laughing. And so, we have so many moments.
MJR: Yeah, I need to write them down.
ER: They are written down. They are written down in our hearts, honey.
Sometimes I think about when people say a mind is a terrible thing to waste. But you know what? The heart is the terrible thing to waste.
MJR: How many men would do the things that you do as far as taking care of me? Like putting on my shoes today.
ER: Well, that’s what it’s all about. Don’t think about just the memory things. We’re here to remember for each other. Don’t worry about the reading because I’m here to read to you.
MJR: Yeah.
ER: You know, it’s about us taking care of one another. You’ve given me, Mary, a reason for living. I always told you that, though. You’re my angel.
So, it’s true. It’s true what they say about when they say wait on God, that he’ll send you that person. You know? And he knew what was in my heart.
MJR: Wow. I love you.
ER: I love you.
[MUSIC]
HOST: Ed Roy with his wife, Mary Johnson-Roy…
All of Mary’s conversations are archived at the Library of Congress…
Mary Johnson-Roy and her son, Laramiun Byrd. Courtesy of Mary Johnson-Roy.
Oshea Israel and Mary Johnson-Roy in 2011 and in 2023. By Gaspar Caro and Brian Mogren for StoryCorps.
Mary Johnson-Roy and her husband, Ed Roy, in Minneapolis, Minnesota in 2023. By Brian Mogren for StoryCorps.